In my opinion spanking is a form of corporal punishment. It is not allowed in daycares and why should parents use it. It teaches kids that it is ok to hit if you are bigger. It makes the parent seem like a big bully in their eyes. I think parents use it because their parents did and it is sort of a last resort when there are seemingly no other options. Of course the alternatives depend on the age of the child, but we do have other choices available. Use of threats is also a no-no. Children need consistency and desire to be guided in the right direction. Parents need to have resources available and that may take a little work. Establishing a short list of rules with the child partaking in an active role is a positive step towards resolution. Children need options, and choices available. Parents need to model the appropriate behavior for their children to learn. Hitting can lead to a loss of temper that could be very dangerous in regards to safety. Redirection of the child is helpful. Also, taking their fun away is an other alternative. A time out should be used as a cooling off period so the child can gain their composure and decide what options they have. Parents need to remember not to punish a child, but to discipline.
Nancy
KidzClubPreschool@msn.com
Although I agree with some of your points, spanking is Biblical. You should not, however, EVER spank out of anger. That is when spanking becomes hitting. Redirection, time out, and choices can work, but for some, especially strong-willed children, spanking is the most effective if it is done in a way that is directed by the Bible.
I guess i am unfamiliar with spanking as a biblical term? Anyway, I remeber being spanked by my dad when i was little. It was always because I was being naughty. I tried to spank my daughter once and she laughed. I don't think that will work!
"spare the rod, spoil the child." not sure what verse it is from though. My oldest boy did laugh as well when I spanked him. It needs to hurt for it to mean something...I have no real answers when it comes to discipline because it is different for each child and parent. My boys also laugh when they are put in a time-out.. my oldest when I was potty training would tell me he had to 'go real bad' if I put him in a time out. I think the number one thing is consistancy and if you do promise something whether it be a reward or a punishment you have to follow thru with it.
Sandra
Healthy Home, Healthy Family, Healthy Income
www.momfriendlywork.com
I did a discipline report for college and learned that the phrase "spare the rod, spoil the child" is not from the bible at all.
Can you tell me where it came from then? Sorry to say I am not able to quote you the exact verse... but it is in there somewhere, just maybe worded differently.
Sandra
Healthy Home, Healthy Family, Healthy Income
www.momfriendlywork.com
It is worded somewhat like that in the bible. But not "spare the rod, spoil the child" which is the most common phrase used.
it's definitely biblical.
me and my hubby looked up all kinds of stuff on spanking in the bible and it is definitely in there!
if you want verses i can do some homework and get it to you.. but i'll only do it if someone asks cuz with two lil guys stuff like that is more work!.
http://www.sanfordhealth.org/CradleRoll/BabyList.cfm?CradleRollParentId=22614
The only time I have ever contemplated spanking was when I was mad, I am a firm believer to never take any action verbal or physical while mad so I have never spanked. I was a spanked a couple of times growing up and I remember jumping right as the spoon was about to hit my butt, it missed though and I got a huge welt on my back. It just scary to me.
Listen to your heart, it whispers softly so listen closely.
I have a question about your statement that threats are a no-no. Isn't it ok to threaten the taking away of a toy, a special priveledge etc....as long as it is a threat you can and will follow thru on, I don't see how it is possible to discipline a child without it. How exactly is a warning different then a threat?
Sandra
Healthy Home, Healthy Family, Healthy Income
www.momfriendlywork.com
Like you said, follow through. If it is threat it is meaningless if not carried out. I like the term "warning" as you mentioned. The child is then making a choice. If they choose to continue their negative behavior then they loose their privledge, or toy. Yes, consistency is very important. Good thoughts and input ladies!
Nancy
KidzClubPreschool@msn.com
Spanking never worked for my kids. Time out worked wonders. I'm not much of a "threatener" I say stop and give one chance and then time out. My kids responded well to it (stopped the behavior)
I believe in spanking. I look back to my childhood and the best lessons I learned were when I got spanked. I'll never forget a time when my dad hauled me out of church and spanked me in the church parking lot b/c I was being disrespectful in church. My parents did not spank often but they did when I deserved it. The verse from the Bible "spare the rod, spoil the child," speaks volumes. There are far too many kids that aren't properly punished and the consequences are these spoiled and disrespectful kids. I can tell a big difference between children that were raised when I was and children that were raised today. No, I don't think that spanking should be used all the time, but for those big lessons, I think spanking is absolutely acceptable. Spanking is like any other form of punishment; if used too often and not for the right reason, it will become useless.
I believe in spanking. I have a degree in Early Childhood and I too was taught that you should never spank in the curriculum. But,the comment that it's biblical is true.
Proverbs 13:24
He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him.
Discipline does not need to involve a swat but can. It should never be done to "hurt" the child and it should never be done when a parent is so angry that they may hurt the child. When spanking, it is best done in a closed room with just the parent and child - not in front of other children. Start with an explaination of the offense followed by the spanking. Finish with letting your child know that you love them but they are not allowed to break the rules.
A note here is that the child should be well aware of your consequences for disobedient actions. It should not surprise them that they will receive a spanking. During the bad behavior, tell them what your expectations are and what consequence will follow. If it continues, follow through! My two-year old was throwing a fit about eating the breakfast that he picked out. I warned him that if he continued crying and throwing a fit, I would swat him and put him to bed- he understood. I stepped away and he didn't stop. When I returned, I followed through. Within ten minutes I had a brand new boy. I got him out of bed and he ate all of his breakfast with a smile. Discipline is a gift to your child. It helps build self-control.
Very well put Dana! Thank you for finding out what verse that was.
I find everyones comments very interesting. I never got spanked when I was a child although I know that there were times I probably should have. I always told myself that I would not spank my child. Well, now there are times that I think she needs a little swat. I have maybe done it once or twice but I feel bad, I dont want others to think I beat my child, but there are times that I truly think that is what she needs to get her attention. I dont know if it is just my child or not but mine can be extremely naughty and when she doesnt get what she wants she throws the biggest tantrums. Granted she is only 2 but I think to myself when she is doing that should I spank her or not, what to do????
there is a difference between beating a child and spanking them!
spanking is done out of love.
and you may feel bad for doing it, but you're doing it to help her, not hurt her.
i've done lotsa research on spanking and i've read (from forums and posts and stuff) that a lot of mothers cry after they spank their kids (afterwards.. when the kid isn't around).
http://www.sanfordhealth.org/CradleRoll/BabyList.cfm?CradleRollParentId=22614
I have found this discussion interesting. I am fairly new to this site. I really like the way Dana made her point. I also have an Early Childhood Education Degree and an Elementarty Education Certificate. As a child I remember being spanked twice and both times I needed it. I have struggled many times with to spank or not to spank. I have two boys ages 3,5. My younger son had some delays in PT, Speech, and OT. He was in therapy until he turned 3 and the state said he no longer qualified for services. My point it I find it much harder to spank him if he truly needed one. I feel bad about punishing him since he has come such a long way to catch up. On the other hand I worry if I don't give him proper punishment for his actions what am I teaching him. Sometimes I think he knows that his punishments aren't the same as his brother so I think he thinks he can get aways with more. I need advice on how to punish fairly.
I am personally tired of seeing so many kids acting like lunatics in public because their parents don't do anything about it. The kids in my apartment building run wild, say horrible things to their parents, refuse to follow directions, are rude and disrespectful. All their parents do about it is yell. I don't know why they expect that to work. Children figure out very quickly how to tune out the sound of a parent yelling if they know that is all that will happen to them. My children have their moments but they are fully expected to behave themselves. They don't get yelled at, because they know what is expected of them and they know what will happen if they stray from that expectation. If we go out, I lay out a brief "policy" about behavior before we leave and give them very specific consequences. Usually I just let them know that as soon as the behavior deteriorates, we will be leaving. If we go to Target and I won't be buying any toys, I let them know that in the car, not as we are passing the toy department. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure, right?! They do get spanked at times but I do not usually have to go that far. Time out (in the corner!) and removing toys or privileges is usually sufficient.
I haven't really gotten to the discipline stage with my daughter yet, but I was spanked as a child because of the whole bible stuff and it has caused some real anger issues for me. My parents used the back side of a large brush to spank me and I remember being so angry when they did it. I had a lot of pent up anger that I could not act on because I knew I would just continue to be spanked. Sure, it got me to behave because I did not want the reprecussions, but it has caused issues for me now. Today, I do not know how to deal with my anger very well and I can get very frustrated to the point of blowing up, much like what happened when I was a child. I won't spank because of it. Just make sure your kids have some kind of an outlet to express their anger.
My siblings and I (well, my brother and I anyway) got spanked with my dad's belt and with the back of a hairbrush. A lot of times it was done in anger on my dad's part and not so much as discipline. I will never, ever, ever use things to spank my child with, but I don't think a little swat with the hand is that harmful if it is really truly called for. It would have to be as a last resort. I am not to the point where my son needs to be disciplined yet, so I don't have any experience with my child misbehaving.
I won't be spanking my daughter. There are a million other ways to handle your child than with spankings.
I think each parent determines what works best for them. This just isn't an option in our household.
It is a personal choice, but I hope one that is not the first resort.
When we were growing up, my mom got mad at one of my sisters, and she said, "do you want me to take this wooden spoon and beat your butt with it" she said no, but continued, then my mom did it, she took that spoon and hit it on the side of the counter, and a piece went flying!!! After that, we would listen if she asked if she needed to get out that wooden spoon....she would also keep one in the car under the drivers seat too. Maybe we will try that tactic! (when our kids are older, we were in 2,3 &5 grade) It always got us to listen right away, and NO she never did use it.
We are spankers. However, I HAVE to consistently pray for wisdom in my parenting. I recently read a book called, Sheparding your child's heart. The author said something that I haven't yet been able to get out of my mind. He had asked a boy what his parents would be more upset about him breaking a loved vase of his moms or him being disobedient. He immediately responded with the broken vase. I do NOT want my child to ever feel like that. I give Micah clear instructions on what will happen if he continues the behavior that he is doing. We have a warning, which makes a big difference. Then he has to sit in his room for a couple minutes (primary purpose of this is a cooling off period for mom or dad and time to re-check if our hearts are right) and then I go in a talk to him about the importance of being obedient and listening to mommy. After that, I spank him. I hope that if I am consistent when he is little this won’t be as big of an issue when he is older.
I can honestly say that I (100% my opinion) can see an obvious difference of kids that are spanked vs. those who aren’t.
I think we, as parents have to be cautious in anything we do discipline wise. I know of parents who have refused to spank because of issues they had with their parents. So instead of spanking, they resort to yelling, which can also cause long term scaring, emotionally.
It just reminds me of what a gift children are and how we have to be so careful because we don’t have that many years to parent in the scheme of their lives.
And probably the biggest lesson I have learned in regards to discipline is to PICK YOUR BATTLES (especially in the toddler years!)
I do not agree with spanking at all. I will never spank my daughter. She is almost 4 years old and is a very well behaved polite little girl. I feel that if you teach a child the right way to act then most of the time they will do that. There is not a choice to act up. I see when my daughter does act up it is almost always when she is tired and needs a nap or to just rest. I then tell her she needs to either go in her bedroom and cool down a bit and think about her actions or get a pillow and blanket and lay down on the couch and relax. I have told my daughter she needs a time-out, but that really means just relax and don't get so upset about something and cool yourself down. I do not have to pick her up and put her in a corner or anything. I see so many kids acting just horrible nad I do not get it at all. I am a very calm person and my daughter has always been in a calm invironment. Maybe I just have some angel child that is perfect, but I do not have any issues that would ever cause for spanking. I don't want to sound like some sickening mother here, but we do not have issues. I think you teach your children how to behave from the time they are newborn. If they see not doing the right things, then they are going to pick up on that. I feel that there is never a reason that hitting needs to be the answer. We teach our children not to hit, so what makes it ok to spank them.
I have a niece who is like that. Unfortunately my oldest has taken after my husband & I and is VERY strong willed. I have heard different parents say that each kid, even in their own family, is so different in how the respond to discipline. My son started very young trying to see how far he could push the envelope, for example, if we tell him not to touch something (a paper cutter, a can of pop, a book or something) he will look at us and get as close to touching the book as he possibly can without actually touching it. Then he looks at you the whole time to see what we think. I would consider myself a calm person, especially around my children. So I just look at him, then as he is circling his finger around the object, he continues to look at me and then, of course touches it. Followed by a "What are you going to do now" look. I'm just hoping my youngest is like your daughter! Don't get me wrong, I think Micah just likes to keep me on my toes. Maybe this is the result of my mother saying things like, "I hope you have a child just like you!" Thanks, mom. :)
I agree that all children are different in their own little ways. One thing that I have noticed is if you don't want a child to touch something or do something, don't even put that thought into their head. Tell them nicely and calmly not to please if they do, but I think a lot of parents set themselves up for things to go wrong by saying, "don't do..." You are putting those ideas in their head and maybe if you didn't say anything they wouldn't have even tried it. My mom always tells me that if I press my luck and have another child someday I am going to be in for it because I got off so easy this time!!:) She also says, you are in for it when she is a teenager because if they are good when they are little they are horrible teenagers and if they are wild and crazy when they are little then they will be a breeze in the teen years. Who knows, there is no going back now and you get what you get!!:)
Amen sister!! :)
I keep thinking I am going to have these loving teenage boys someday! Wishful thinking, I'm sure, but we'll see. It's also important to me to make sure things I am doing are not contributing to my child's behavior. Did I stay out and about to long and we missed nap? Is supper a half hour later than normal? Etc. There was a shirt at Children's Place that I have thought about and probably should get Micah, it says, "I'm just acting my age!" Sometimes I forget he is 2. I get frustrated during his tantrums, (like today in the library) but realize he is only 2 and is trying to figure out all of his emotions, too.
I just sent you a PM, I think our kids were dancing together at the concert!
I tend to agree with your mom about look out when they are older if they were easy toddlers because I have a 12-year-old that was the easiest child imaginable when she was little. I never had a single problem with her EVER!!!! She absolutely always did what she was supposed to do without ever testing limits, so now she is starting to test those limits. Don't get me wrong, she is still a great kid, but I think all children NEED to test limits at some point, and if they don't do it as toddlers, they probably will later. Children need to see where the boundaries are, and they want to know their parents will enforce the boundaries without fail. That is what makes them feel safe and loved. Obviously, there is no spanking with her, I cannot imagine a reason that would be okay with a child her age, so it is really about loss of privileges (no computer, no i-pod, etc.) and that really seems to work, although some days I feel like I could pull my hair out! On the flip side, I have a 3 year old and a 2 year old that are definitely doing their limit-testing as toddlers!! I am hoping that means we will have it easy when they are teenagers, because I'm afraid by then I'm going to be a little worn out!!:) Anyway, I am not against spanking, but agree it needs to never be done out of anger. I can honestly say that we don't have occaisions to spank because I believe, too, that children who understand very clearly what the boundaries are, and what the consequences will be will behave the way you would like them to. Children have a desire to please their parents and want to make us happy. If they know what we expect and what will happen if they don't do as they are told, they will almost always do it. In our house, spanking is reserved for situations where the child is putting him/herself in danger, and has not listened to words. In those situations (i.e. running into traffic in a parking lot, etc.) they may require a swat on the behind, but again, we haven't really had an issue with that because they know what is expected. I am told all the time how lucky I am to have 5 such well-behaved children, and I remember, though not often enough, to thank God all the time for these little people. I think that, too, helps because when I remember that being their mommy is a gift from God, and that my job is to guide them and teach them how to be good, kind, caring human beings, it is easy for me to teach with love, and not discipline out of anger.
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To spank or not to spank that is the question. How do you discipline your kids?